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March 27, 2005

"Liberals just don't get it" topics

So I'm cruising around the Internet reading lefty weblogs (an odd addiction, I know) and I'm starting to see a story beginning to proliferate about, again, Saudi citizens being evacuated from the United States immediately following the events on 9/11. Although no real evidence is ever given, these people (ala Michael Moore) hope that your conspiratorial paranoia microchip is well functioning, and that you'll reason through conjecture that George Bush is either behind the 9/11 attacks, or he's unwilling to punish the real guilty parties out of loyalty to his corporate greed. So now, apparently, there are some new reports (though it seems to me about previously established evidence) regarding the timelines of these Saudi departures, and the lefties think that the reports will help their case. It's enough to make you hold your head in your hand and whisper, "Not AGAIN!"

Liberals keep coming up with this "See, I we told you!" stuff as if to suggest that if only mainstream America had known what these much smarter angry lefties had known, then they'd have voted to "throw the bum" out of office. But the truth is that nobody cares except for them. They're preaching to the choir and (erroneously) congratulating themselves for being smarter than everyone else. I think it's a pretty safe bet that if any or all of this stuff had come out before the election, Bush would've won by just as great, and probably a greater margin than he actually managed. The liberal wacko rants would have, if anything, driven even more voters into Bush's tent. (Note: it's not the facts that are wacko, it's the conclusions which the lefties hope that we'll draw from those facts which are wacko.)

These people are behaving as if the vote isn't over and they didn't lose. They're like a gathering of poor sports crying and whining at the 2nd yard of a football field, screaming about the unfairness of an alleged missed call, a foul not punished, and a victory unfairly taken. But victory has been declared, the awards have been given out, the teams have showered and gone home, the spectators have left the stadium, and even the clean-up crews have snatched up the last discarded wax-paper Coke cup from under the bleachers. As these few wail on that second yard line, the occasional leaf swirls past them in the breeze.

Ironically, its moveon.org that never does. Figure that one out.

One should note that I'm not specifically referring to the blogger I linked to above, but instead to the character of the blogging on the issue in the aggregate. I actually chose to link to the weblog above because of its subdued hyperbole, rather than being overtly hysterical.

ps: I seem to have found a bug in this version of Movable Type. I copy/pasted the trackback url in the "URLs to ping" field, wrote my post, previewed it, edited it slightly, then decided that I didn't like the UPPERCASE domain in the trackback url - so I edited it down to lowercase. Upon saving the entry (publishing), Movable Type pinged both uppercase and lowercase versions of the trackback URL. The uppercase must've been stored, somehow, when I previewed the comment. I guess.

Posted by Jeff at March 27, 2005 05:39 PM

Comments

No evidence? Just a New York Times article based on statements by the FBI. Whatsamatter, you don't believe the FBI?

And the point isn't that the Bush admin caused 9/11 -- it's that it seriously, seriously bungled the response. Among many other things.

Posted by: Michael Froomkin at March 27, 2005 08:30 PM


Ah...a different conclusion: incompetence. Adding another possible conclusion to the pot of negativity increases the chances that someone will choose one of them. But it really doesn't matter: the people have voted, and he's not going to run for re-election again.

Arguably, it still matters because the people need to be aware of his screw-ups. But in the final analysis, even if he did bungle it, we judge by the bottom line - and the bottom line is that he's done an excellent job overall.

Posted by: Jeff at March 28, 2005 11:41 PM


For example, turning the budget surplus to a deficit? Weakening the dollar? Rising interest rates? The strength of the job market? Destruction of our reputation abroad? Big trade deficit? North Korea? 1,500+ US casualties in a war started on false pretenses? US citizen held in military confinement, without charges or access to counsel in complete violation of the US constitution? Trying to destroy social security? Environmental degradation based on doctored evidence?

Where exactly is the "excellent job overall"? Or even three examples?

Posted by: Michael Froomkin at March 29, 2005 09:38 AM


I've held off on answering until I felt certain that I could resist the temptation to actually give you the 3 examples that you asked for. If you did, I'd have picked black-and-white ideological issues which the right side of the congressional aisle would hail as triumphs of good, but which you would most likely include within your list of injuries which Bush has allegedly perpetrated upon our country.

Instead, I'd like to take issue with your list.

Consider this paragraph from a Canadian government page regarding rats in Alberta:

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/prm3266?opendocument :

[quote]
Fifty years ago, a rat infestation was discovered near Alsask, in central Alberta. The province reacted immediately to halt further westward rat migration. Due to the Rat Patrol's vigilance, our province has saved an estimated one billion dollars over 50 years, in property damage, livestock losses, human suffering and healthcare, as well as lost and contaminated food.
[/quote]

This is the same type of argument that those of us who approve of President Bush's presidency would make about his war on terror (which includes Iraq). People who make the kind of arguments which you have made typically point out that Osama bin Laden hasn't been caught, and that's some kind of a big deal to you. Well, guess what...it's a big deal to me, too. On May 30th, 2002, I made this comment:

[quote]
I've hated this "bin Laden" thing since the beginning - people (not so much people in the U.S., but people from Europe) kept making a big deal in posts out of catching bin Laden, as if that's even important! I hope he's never caught, because if he is, weirdos around the world are going to start saying, "You caught him - go home."
[/quote]

Not only do many of us not consider Bush's handling of 9/11 to have been "bungled", we consider much what you would call mistakes to have been akin to gambits in chess. We're more than happy to have our player give up his queen, even if the lesser savvy members of the audience boo the manoeuver, if we get a greater benefit (including the win of the game) as a result. In this case, we've taken a pass at going after one of the other side's pieces using our whole board, and instead keep it (the queen, bin Laden) in check with just a rook. That is more than adequate.

This is a military matter with much wider stakes than merely a law enforcement issue in which the perpetrators of 9/11 need be caught and tried. We're going after the causes (middle eastern culture), not the symptoms.

Posted by: Jeff at March 30, 2005 01:24 AM


I do so wish you would stop puttying such stupid arguments in my mouth. The claim against Bush's handling of the war is that he made us weaker. Here are just a few examples.

* Destroying the army -- not just the casualities and the wear and tear, but our inability to deploy where and when needed. And now we hear that enlistments have collapsed and the draft may be needed in 12 months.

* Angering our allies, friends, and formely not-enemies

* Turning Iraq into a arms supply for all the bad guys in the world by not securing weapons and high explosives, and by creating an anarchy that breeds and harbors the next generation of terrorist

* By doing a very large amount of stupid stuff at home in the name of security that actually shoots us in the foot instead of protecting us.

If rats have anything to do with this, it's the ones in the West Wing.

Posted by: Michael Froomkin at March 31, 2005 07:47 PM


I'm enjoying this thread.... :-)

Posted by: kenny at April 1, 2005 09:02 AM


^----It seems to me that when people start offering sentiments of frustration about others in the discussion, there's really not much of a discussion left.

"* Destroying the army -- not just the casualities and the wear and tear, but our inability to deploy where and when needed. And now we hear that enlistments have collapsed and the draft may be needed in 12 months."

Wait..."and the draft may be needed in 12 months"? That sounds like a set-up for the next Democrat in office: use a past Republican administration to justify what a Republican administration would never do (re-instate the draft). There's just one more reason to never vote Democrat: keeping our armed forces entirely volunteer.

Posted by: Jeff at April 1, 2005 03:26 PM


I have a veiled chameleon, but I was wondering if the cage is a good size it's 27 3/8" long and
31" tall and 14 1/2 in depth.

Please type me back!!

Posted by: Blake Swartwood at November 16, 2005 05:20 PM


These comments were most interesting. I realize Bush has made a few mistakes, and haven't we all.......but line was said.the bottom line is that he's doing heck of a good job. I don't think anyone could do a better job under the difficult and horrendous issues this President has had laid out on his desk.
I don't know when I have ever seen a President have so many things happening during his Presidency to deal with then what Bush has had. Unfortunately, his problems are compounded by the hate coming from the Left. Unfortunately the liberals can not see their behavior as harmful and destructive which has made Pres.Bush's job even harder. Even our Military who has the hardest job of all, gets no praise or postive rhetoric from the Left. Hopefully the American voters will remember all this at election time.

Posted by: emily cinicola at May 2, 2006 03:32 AM


Pay attention to the facts and be objective. You people rant and rave about what you want when the answers are always clear if you are honest. Left and right will never agree on this, beacause the answer is in the middle.

Posted by: anybody at December 9, 2006 06:09 PM


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